I didn’t fully realise it when I arranged to meet him but Mark Badger of Iron Man Records is perhaps the perfect interview subject for this blog. Having found himself involved in the punk rock scene first playing in bands, then putting on gigs and soon after running a record label, he decided to take what he’d learned from this DIY environment and try to apply it to the entire music spectrum with the Birmingham Music Network. He’s also perfect because he talks. And talks. And talks. And all of it is relevant and fascinating. The interview was conducted on a Friday lunchtime in Jibbering Records, Moseley over plenty of coffee.
Having lived all over the country Mark moved to Birmingham in 1990 and, other that a couple of years in London in the 90s, has been here ever since. From 1997 – 2000 he played in the “sort of post-hardcore weird stuff” band The Hot Tortoise and then with the “punk influenced” Last Under The Sun.
Do It Yourself
“At the time, my only friends were those who were struggling with their own band projects. None of us had any money to record Demo tapes, we had all suffered at the hands of rip-off promoters, nobody seemed interested in promoting Punk/Hardcore in Birmingham unless you had a record contract and some of us were considering giving up altogether because no one was willing to offer support. This was not to be. The group of bands decided that if no one was willing to help out, it was time to do it for ourselves. Between us we started booking and playing our own shows on regular basis, sharing the tasks of organisation, promotion and performance and any money that we made was shared between us to cover costs of band practice and promotional literature for the next show.”
From these beginnings Mark set up Badger Promotions, putting on gigs with similar bands from other cities and building up contacts around the country. This soon led to formation of Iron Man Records which Mark has been running full time ever since.
“I played in a band, I organised shows, the next logical step was put a record out for the one of the bands that was doing well. And then having put out one band I thought I’d put out another, and then another, and it’s just carried on and here I am ten years later and I’m still putting out records by bands that I’ve established a relationship with. I thought they’re good people, they need support, no-one else is working with them so I’ll work with them.
“The latest band that I’m working with is Nightingales who were always known as a Birmingham based band though Rob Lloyd, their singer, lives in Telford. An again, I got to know Rob over a period of time. His band played the Old Railway when I was a music promoter there, and the guitarist at the time was a bloke called Pete Birchmore who played in G.O.R.G.E.O.U.S. and so it was a logical step when Rob Lloyd said we’d like Iron Man Records put out our next record, are you interested, of course the answer was yes because he’d put in the time with the shows and I knew them personally.
“Dufus, the other band I’m working with, are from New York but the first time they played in England they played at the Old Railway where I was a music promoter. They didn’t really know how to tour in England or who to get shows from so before they came I was sending them email addresses of other music promoters that I’d met or other bands that I knew who might be able to help them out, so all their gigs on that tour were with people I knew personally. Again, I didn’t think of putting out their records because at the time I didn’t have any money to work with them, and as the years past they worked with other people who let them down and didn’t really do for them what they’d hoped, so in the end they returned to me for help.
“So it’s not like someone sends me a CD and I’ll put their album out. I’ll establish a relationship with bands over a period of months or years. Iron Man Records has never been a label that tries to go out and find the best bands and work with them. The label has always worked with bands that I felt were putting the work in and deserved a break who I have got to know on a personal level”
Having myself been involved in the underground comics and fanzine world during the 90s as essentially a promoter of stuff I identified a lot with Mark’s experiences. These social networks, frequently distributed across the globe and connected by the postal system, work as a kind of meritocracy where individuals become known for what they do rather than who they are. Mark, as someone who was doing a lot, started getting a reputation as someone you could call for information on anything related to the production and promotion of music. This lead to the creation of the Birmingham Music Network, a more formal version of helping musicians that’s not directly related to Iron Man Records.
The Birmingham Music Network
“I was involved in a gig called The European Collective Across the Decades which was a big event that some friends of mine asked me to be involved with in 2000. It was a case of ringing round 25, 26 bands that between us we all knew to come play a gig in Milton Keynes and then ringing round all the promoters we knew all across France, Germany, Spain, Italy, and saying “we’re organising this gig, come over and we’ll organise it between us.” When I saw that people from all over Europe and from the rest of the world could come together for a weekend and put on an event for 4,000 people over a couple of days and make it a really big success, I thought, well, if Europe’s music promoters and some of the best underground bands in Europe can come together and make this happen then it’s got to be possible to get people in the West Midlands music scene to come together and do things together on a smaller scale. So hence, rather than try to continue the European Collective thing, which worked as a one off but would have been a nightmare as an ongoing project, the Birmingham Music Network was born, to try and get people in the West Midlands area to take a day out once a month to give their time to try to help everybody become more competitive on the market outside the West Midlands.
“If you opened a music directory and go through the categories we’ve had representatives from pretty much every category turn up. And certainly at any given meeting if someone’s there saying I need to speak to a music accountant, if there’s no a music accountant sat round the table there’s always somebody who’s got a phone number for one. The Music Network meetings are more than just a meeting of the people involved. It’s the address books and the contacts that those people bring to the table as well. We had a lady who came to the table the other day. She’s a DJ and just starting out playing shows in Birmingham, just moved to the area and doesn’t know anything about the West Midlands and by the time the meeting had finished she had several phone numbers and a list of email addresses of people to contact. And even though none of those people were actually at the meeting there were those who’d listened to what she had to say and were willing to help her out. The value of the meeting is more than just the people sat around the table. The whole is greater than the sum of the parts.”
“The music scene that I’ve been involved with tends to look after itself very well, but it also tends to box itself into a corner where people are so busy trying to be independent that they don’t really see much further than their own little world. So the Music Network was trying take some of the good things about the music scene I was involved with, the networking side of things, helping each other out, sharing experiences, sharing contacts, sharing resources, sharing skills, trying to take that out of what I’d learned over the last 15 years and try and put it into a more formal framework. The idea was to apply for some funding to provide people with wages, fund an office and provide a formal base where people with a question could go rather than ringing me and coming to my office. Don’t forget, I’m very specialised in terms on my knowledge in the guitar / rock / punk / acoustic thing but I know nothing about dance music, I know nothing about all the other genres on the planet. It’s all very well me helping people who are in to what I’m into but for reggae artists, dance artists, bhangra artists, electronic artists, even classical musicians, I don’t really feel like I’m the best person to be advising or signposting them on where to get the help. So getting the funding for the music network was really to try and establish an infrastructure that would bring in ideas and specialists from all areas to help and support those different genres that operate in the West Midlands.
“And for a couple of years it worked pretty well. We managed to get an office up and running and get some staff in and a lot of good things happened, but unfortunately it wasn’t possible to continue the funding and it wasn’t possible to continue the project. There are other types of funding and support that have tried to pick up on the idea but I don’t really feel they’re delivering either in spirit or in terms of practical application the most suitable help and support just yet. I hope they prove me wrong!”
Despite funding being withdrawn in 2002 the Music Network still operates with meetings taking place each month at the Birmingham Chambers of Commerce and moving to the Technology Innovation Centre in January. But while the project has proven itself able to survive without access to the money tree and, given that people continue to turn up, satisfies the requirements of its members, Mark feels the decision to terminate the project as an official entity is indicative of a problem he sees throughout the city in relation to strategic investment.
Sustainability and Investment
“Let me give you an example of a project that I’m actually involved with, because I don’t want to start making suggestions about other projects because that’s totally out of order. Money’s coming for Europe and being paid out to a company whose remit is to take a couple of specialists from the West Midlands, team them up with a couple of creative companies and help them generate more than £7000 from their creative endevours over the next couple of years. And I think, in spirit, that’s great. That’s good news. There’s money coming from Europe and it’s to support creatives in the West Midlands. I’m being paid to help a couple of acts earn more than £7000 but I can’t give them any money. The project can’t give them any money. And whilst I’m filling their brains to bursting point with information, knowledge, experience, contacts, resources, access to any information they want, quite often, certainly with the acts I’m working with, all of these contacts and resources are completely useless to them unless they’ve got a product that they can market, promote and tour. Earning £7000 from your creative activity becomes really difficult if you don’t have a good enough product to sell. And of course, in my personal view, I’m only doing half of the equation. I’m just giving knowledge support. I believe the way these projects could be more effective is if it wasn’t just knowledge being given to these people but they were given some degree of financial support so they can get a product together which can then maximise the benefit of having all this knowledge.
“The last time I counted in 2003 there were 21 trading record labels in the Birmingham Area. And what I want to know is why aren’t there more? I’ve seen plenty of people start a creative business with some great ideas, but I’ve also watched many more people, after only a year or two close down, or go bankrupt, or turn their business back into a hobby alongside a full time job somewhere else. Its not easy trying to become a sustainable or profitable businesses in your own right. There’s a lot of money pouring into the West Midlands but I can’t see a high proportion of businesses that are still here 10 years later. Being Britain’s second city there should be more record labels really and I don’t understand why there aren’t more. In terms of music promoters, Arthur at the Jug of Ale is still here 15 or more years later. Zoot are still here 10 or 15 years later. I did it for 10 years but I had to change my focus because the record label was consuming more of my time and the groundhog day experience of walking into the same place night after night sent me insane. Scott from Solar Creations is still here, clinging on by his fingernails probably. But I don’t think the Barfly is going to be here in 10 years time. The Institute has never been an easy place to work from – it’s a big space with high rent and a lot of overheads. The Carling Academy, I don’t know how long that’s going to be around for. It’s just worrying that there’s all these great opportunies, they start, they have great ideas and then they struggle and fail.”
Given all this, is there any way of influencing how the money is distributed?
“Yeah, I think Digital Central works very hard to try and bring together people from all across the West Midlands music scene. Rather than saying we’ve got money, we’re going to give it out or spend it, what Digital Central have done is brought people together and said, all right, you keep winging and moaning about this or you’ve got views about that, let’s hear your views and then let’s see you make decisions for yourselves as a group of industry experts. One of the problems that we’ve had in the West Midlands is that decisions have been made by public servants or members of local government who don’t really understand how the music industry works or even how the creative industry works. It’s the age old problem: people with ideas have no infrastraucture or finance, the people with the infrastructures or finances have no idea how to use them effectively. And historically one of the problems that we’ve had is that the people who’ve been advising civil servants or local government about how to make decisions affecting all of us have not been either representative of the people the funding is there to benefit or may not have been the best people to be advising. So while Digital Central is another funding organisation answerable to local government, rather than taking the decisions themselves they’ve tried to get industry people sat round the table, in music, in radio, in all the different genres and say, right, we need to make decisions as a group of people who are much better informed to make them. So I’m quietly confident that Digital Central is actually going to finally, after years and years of ridiculous decisions being made, make decisions based on effective advice and suggestions from the people who the funding will hopefully benefit. If Digital Central can set the bench mark and demonstrate an example of how decisions can be made in future then hopefully that’ll have a benefit and a knock-on effect on the way the funding agencies operate in future. Of course if Digital Central falls on its arse and everybody makes decisions for their own personal benefit, or for their mate’s benefit then really we might as well pack up and go home because there is no hope for the West Midlands as far as funding’s concerned! Someone please prove me wrong!â€
Elsewhere
One thing I was keen to ask Mark, given his contacts with music types around the country, was how Birmingham compared to other cities.
“The are several levels to this. I think Birmingham has actually got a lot more going for it. For example there’s a lot people who live here. Birmingham’s also very diverse. There’s a lot of different types of people that live here. And we’re also in the middle of the country which means we’re easy to get to – if you’re playing gigs in the West Midlands people can come from all sorts of places to find you. So geographically, population wise and the diversity of the population there’s a lot of good things going for the West Midlands. But there’s also a lot of things that work against Birmingham. Because Birmingham’s so big it tends to break off into little pieces so different styles of music will have a couple of venues where they operate and regular nights. Other styles of music will do their thing somewhere else. Moseley’s got it’s own little scene and people can live and die in Moseley.
“I would also say on a positive front that Birmingham’s also got access to a lot of funding that other cities haven’t got. If you’re a band in Birmingham, because Birmingham’s got a couple of the most deprived wards in the country there is European Social Fund money available so that if you live within those postcodes you can access financial help and support to help you do something positive. By comparison if you live in Oxford or somewhere like that, it doesn’t have two of the most deprived wards in Europe so there’s no government funding.
“Any city has got its strengths and weaknesses. Aberdeen for example, I was up there recently with Dufus and the band played at a venue called The Tunnels. I don’t think it’s a funded project but it looks like somebody’s spent a lot of money on that venue. They’ve got a great sound system, good bar and then next door they’ve got a vegan and vegetarian restaurant. So from the outside (I didn’t ask too many questions) it would appear that they’re generating revenue from the restaurant which then supplies funding and support for the venue, but the venue also brings customers from all over Scotland to come and see bands who if they’re hungry will then eat in the restaurant. Places like The Tunnels clearly demonstrate what can be done if you’re really committed to your music and the bloke who owns The Tunnels owns a local record shop as well. I think financially they’ve got a good thing going there where they’ve diversified and spread the risk over a number of different business activities so when Dufus played there they got paid well, they got fed, they got great sound and plenty of people turned up to see them play.
Venues
“By comparison, in Birmingham, a lot of the venues are just venues. When there’s no music playing the place is empty. Of course the venue is very important to bring people in who want to drink beer but the bands aren’t always guaranteed to get the best financial return and they don’t get always fed. Take for example Arthur at the Jug of ale, certainly for Dufus he will provide food, but a lot of the bands who play the Jug of Ale won’t be fed. And I think that’s the same for a lot of venues in the West Midlands. It’s a pub that makes its money off beer or whatever pubs make their money off and they have a venue to try and bring in more customers. The music is not the focus of their activity. By comparison there’s places like the Barfly where music is the entire focus of their activity but I’m not entirely sure that they’re financially secure. They only earn money when bands are on that stage playing and they’re selling beer. They don’t have any other income streams. Of course they have the name The Barfly which is the brand which I’m sure people identify with and helps them survive.
“For years people have been ranting and raving about how we need a medium sized venue for the West Midlands and I’ve always said from the start, we don’t need a new venue, we just need a more effective management team that run the venues we’ve already got. And they need to be looking at not just where the money is coming from but how can we access other income streams or diversify our activities to secure the finances for the venue. Using the Melkweg in Amsterdam as an example. it’s a venue, it’s a cinema, it’s an art gallery, it’s a cafe, it’s a meeting place, it’s a bar. It has loads of different activities going on and you pay one ticket price to go in, and once you’re in you can access whatever’s going on whilst you’re inside. And compare that to something in the West Midlands – you pay £3 and you see the bands and then you go home again.”
Isn’t The Custard Factory in Digbeth moving towards something along these lines?
“The Custard Factory is successful in that it’s got a critical mass going whereby people work there, eat there, go and see music there. So in terms of getting people to a geographical location it’s doing very well. But again I’m not entirely sure how sustainable that is. Every time I walk to the Custard Factory there’s a new business that’s opened up and then next door there’s a business that was new 6 months ago that’s closing down because their startup funding has run out. There seems to be a lot of funding and support to get people into the Custard Factory but when the funding runs out, they go bust and they move out again. I’m sure there are plenty of successful ones too but you’ll have to indulge me on this for a minute. I have this nightmare suspicion that somebody somewhere in each of these funded projects is creaming off a profit out of their involvement in the creative industry and they’re shipping that money elsewhere. The money’s not being ploughed back into the creative industries, its paying mortgages, buying cars, paying off debts, bills, anything but going back into the creative industry itself. So projects are being delivered and the money is being consumed by wages and administration and capital equipment and meetings and launch parties and but it’s not being reinvested into generating new products to sell on to generate a sustainable future. The Custard Factory is not there to help out the creative industries. The Custard Factory is a commercial enterprise so I would assume they collect the rent and they do with it what they see fit. But what the creative industries need is for the funding that’s been invested to find a way of going back into the system to provide a sustainable future. The problem with a lot of these funded projects is the money goes in, the money is taken out and when the funding finishes there’s nothing left to sustain the project. This is something that’s an inherent problem with the way the funding works – the money is spent, it’s not invested. This is why it’s very difficult to make it sustainable.
“On a final note, to give credit where its due I think the successful funded projects in the West Midlands have had the foresight to invest their money wisely, they have not operated on a funded basis only, they have reached beyond the remit of just the funding, they’ve kept their costs down, they’ve diversified or accessed new markets, they’ve invested in new products, they’ve networked, they’ve been open minded and willing to try new techniques and they’ve invested their time wisely and have not been afraid of working in partnership with others to generate something that’s sustainable. They have incorporated other income streams and resources alongside funding to build a successful business”
Mark Badger can be contacted via Iron Man Records and he blogs about music here.
Birmingham Music Network website and MySpace presence.
The Birmingham Music Network mailing list has details of forthcoming meetings and events.
Thanks to Mark for his time.
